|
Log in to post
|
Print Thread |
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 29
Enthusiast
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 29 |
Hi
I have an old song of mine that was written in 4/4 time even though it was full of triplet eighth notes. I want to redo it in 6/8 time. Unfortunately, there are not many B & B Styles in 6/8 so they recommend using 4/4 triplet feel. Well... I've tried for 2 days to get a 4/4 triplet feel track to line up with the main beats of a vocal that was recorded in 6/8 at 65BPM. I've checked ChatGPT and been given all these different timings to use but always the 4/4 track plays slower than the original 6/8 in my DAW. I still want to use B & B style so I can add solos etc. but cannot get things to line up. My DAW is Studio One.
Has anyone ever been successful in adding 4/4 tracks to a 6/8 recording? If so, please let me know how to do it.
I have Time Stretch turned off on the tracks in my DAW. I'm recording from B&B at the same bit rate. I'm totally confused.
Paul
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,301
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,301 |
Howdy Paul....
Have you tried to use 3/4 time vs 4/4?
Twice as many bars but may work.
Personally, I don't write waltz type time signatures but my buddy wrote one long go in 6/8.
I could find nothing usable.
I love BIAB but that's always been a minor annoyance to accept with such a fine program.
Hope that helps a bit.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,943
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,943 |
...........................................
I love BIAB but that's always been a minor annoyance to accept with such a fine program.
......................... It may be a minor annoyance for you but for those of us whom want to record something in other than 3/4/ or 4/4 it is a major problem, especially when one goes from BiaB to a DAW.
I just posted a selfie and all of the responses were get well soon!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 29
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 29 |
Hi. It's more than a minor annoyance. I can't believe B in a B just tell us to use 4/4 with a triplet feel! I don't think they've ever tried to actually do that. PITA!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 29
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 29 |
Howdy. My song is similar in form and sound to Billy Joel's Piano Man (of course - not as good!) I had a couple of different singers (found online) record it at 4/4 even though it's triplets all the way through. It never sounded right. So using EZKeys I got a decent 6/8 piano accompaniment and a drum track using 6/8 EZ Drummer and a bass using EZ Bass - thank God for those programs! But I really need a harmonica solo or some other instrument and I've always been able to do this using B in a Box if the song was 4/4 time.
I'm using the EZ programs more and more and B in a B hardly at all nowadays. Too bad.
Paul
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,656
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,656 |
I wrote a tool years ago for this, it may be helpful. There are a few different calculators on the page, but I tried to describe what they do .. I *think the 3rd one down does what you want. I like math, but not in the middle of recording .. so I created this for quick dirty work. http://tools.masteringmatters.com//since your song is 6/8 I'd half the existing tempo and use 3/4 in the top two boxes .. then put 4/4 in the bottom box ; *should show the new 4/4 tempo once calculated steps - enter half the existing tempo in top box (if it is currently 132 tempo enter 66 .. 132 divided by 2 = 66) enter a 3 in second box enter a 4 in third box Click Calculate Solution shows under the 'new tempo' label I should write it so it does all the odd time sigs, but like I said it was a quickie project to save myself time.
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 18,946
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 18,946 |
Does the post below help? https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=735804#Post735804Extra information for the post... while BIAB doesn't accept tempos with a decimal point, Realband does. So although the above post was written with Cubase in mind, it's possible to do what's needed in Realband (if you have the Windows version of BIAB).
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2024
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,301
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,301 |
[quote=chulaivet1966].I It may be a minor annoyance for you but for those of us whom want to record something in other than 3/4/ or 4/4 it is a major problem, especially when one goes from BiaB to a DAW. Mornin' Mario and Paul.... I was intentionally gentle with my response because I know this has come up before and didn't want to come off as argumentative. I did not mean to diminish the 6/8 importance that others need for their creations. Forgive me, I did not mean to come across the way. I'm truly baffled as to why there isn't a lot more styles in 6/8. It's not like it's some cryptic time sig.. Sincerely. clv .
Last edited by chulaivet1966; 05/08/24 06:35 AM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,943
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,943 |
[quote=chulaivet1966].I It may be a minor annoyance for you but for those of us whom want to record something in other than 3/4/ or 4/4 it is a major problem, especially when one goes from BiaB to a DAW. Mornin' Mario and Paul.... I was intentionally gentle with my response because I know this has come up before and didn't want to come off as argumentative.. I did not mean to diminish the 6/8 importance that others actually need for their creations. Forgive me, if I did come across the way. I'm truly baffled as to why there isn't a lot more styles in 6/8. Sincerely. clv . No problem my friend. BiaB is a fantastic piece of software but has some major problems. What is not a issue for one user is a major problem for another. This is the case for time signatures.
I just posted a selfie and all of the responses were get well soon!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,301
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,301 |
[quote=chulaivet1966] No problem my friend. BiaB is a fantastic piece of software but has some major problems. What is not a issue for one user is a major problem for another. This is the case for time signatures. I hate being misinterpreted on forum responses.  *IIRC*....this topic goes back years and all I recall is some work-around being suggested by the BIAB team. So no, it's not a 'minor annoyance'....it's a determining one for many and I get that. I just didn't phrase my response with proper empathy. I"m old! We have some great forums here and I try to avoid creating any negative drama. Thanks for coming back Mario.
Last edited by chulaivet1966; 05/08/24 06:51 AM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,446
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,446 |
We have some great forums here and I try to avoid creating any negative drama. I on the other hand love "DRAMA". I have a special project I am working on. It is fully 6/8 vibe (currently Drum, Bass and Piano). And in my experience BIAB won't touch this song! No work arounds I can find to fit this into the box or the box into this. In fact, I would challange anyone to prove my wrong. I can provide my 6/8 backing in MIDI or Audio if some one feels they can add any RT soloist to this which would add something musical!
Dan, BIAB2024, SoundCloud Win11, i7(12thGen), 32GB, 1TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD), 2TB Libraries, 1 TB(WD-Black), 2TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD)Data, Motu Audio Express, Keystation 61, SL88 Studio, Reaper
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,656
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,656 |
That seems like a pretty fair challenge.
Does it have to be BiaB or can it be done in RB?
Therein lies the real challenge .. one I may accept, one I will likely not ..
Last edited by rharv; 05/11/24 08:58 AM.
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 2,682
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 2,682 |
DrDan.
just a suggestion...
post the midi somewhere plus audio and indicate what rt instrument sound you want in your project ideally so people can have a crack at your problem useing pg software.
if the chord structure is complex with advanced extensions .might be a good idea to include the chords so people can see what they can do for you useing pg software and content.
i might have a go myself..once i finish ongoing song projects to see if i can succeed or fail the challenge.
happiness..
om🇨🇦 🇬🇧
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 05/10/24 04:15 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 18,946
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 18,946 |
I have a special project I am working on. It is fully 6/8 vibe (currently Drum, Bass and Piano). And in my experience BIAB won't touch this song! No work arounds I can find to fit this into the box or the box into this. In fact, I would challange anyone to prove my wrong. I can provide my 6/8 backing in MIDI or Audio if some one feels they can add any RT soloist to this which would add something musical! It can be done, Dan. It's necessary to keep the ratio 2/3 (or 3/2, depending on which direction you are going in) handy so that you can calculate the tempo change needed to match 6/8 with 4/4. I explain it more fully at the following link. (It's kind of like stoichiometry but with BIAB rather than chemistry.) https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=735804#Post735804--Noel
Last edited by Noel96; 05/11/24 05:01 AM.
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2024
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,166
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,166 |
Definitely doable. In addition to changing the tempo by 2/3 you also need to reduce the chord durations by 1/2. Problem can be when you do the math on the tempo change and it comes up with a fraction, because you can't enter fractions for tempo in BIAB. I asked if there was a workaround for that back in 2018 and Floyd helped me out: https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=491560#Post491560
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,446
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,446 |
Oh boy, I didn't expect that. I guess I had forgotten how much we have spoken about this subject over the years, and the fact that there are some strong advocates for the 6/8 workarounds. I revisited the referenced links this morning and have now decided to withdrawn my challenge since the workaround has been detailed here in the forum in the past. In fact I took a little time to begin to go down that rabbit hole. I got as far as moving the chords which were written in EZK2 in Reaper, over to BIAB. I was immediately hit with the lack of accurate chord recognition in BIAB combined with the placement of chords. Every measure in BIAB had two measures of 6/8 (this was discussed by Noel in the reference thread). I could deal with it, but it did turn me off. So I stopped the effort. Fact is this current project is building well in Reaper using EZK, EZB, EZD and Kontakt. So I will acquiesce that the task is doable, however, don't want to waste anyone’s time forcing this square peg into a round hole. For those interested, here is a sneak peek at the 6/8 project. Vocals have not yet been entered. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rGRTiXHLpLdpPwNMnrFI75LJMEigm-J1/view?usp=sharingThanks to all for the input. Dan
Dan, BIAB2024, SoundCloud Win11, i7(12thGen), 32GB, 1TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD), 2TB Libraries, 1 TB(WD-Black), 2TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD)Data, Motu Audio Express, Keystation 61, SL88 Studio, Reaper
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,943
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,943 |
Dan, I really liked your song.
For any song other than 3/4 or 4/4 it is best to stay away from BiaB. Yes there are workarounds but they are a PITA and still not compatible with the outside world. In this day and age BiaB should be easily workable in all time signatures.
I just posted a selfie and all of the responses were get well soon!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,446
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,446 |
Could not agree more with you Mario. I have always wanted BIAB to play better with other music apps in order to bring the best of all music making things together (...compatible with the outside world, as you say).
Dan, BIAB2024, SoundCloud Win11, i7(12thGen), 32GB, 1TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD), 2TB Libraries, 1 TB(WD-Black), 2TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD)Data, Motu Audio Express, Keystation 61, SL88 Studio, Reaper
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,589
PG Music Staff
|
|
PG Music Staff
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,589 |
BiaB can already make music in any time signature, except the n/8 where n is odd like (1/8, 3/8…)
Existing time signatures can include
1/4, 2/4, 3/4, 4/4, 5/5, 6/4, 7/4…. 11/4 etc.
3/8, 6/8, 9/8, 12/8 also supported.
The thing that bugs people is that for time signatures higher than 4.4, like 5/4, 7/4 etc. we have a bar of 3/4 + 2/4. So you enter the bar of 7/4 over two bars instead of one. And in the case of 6/8 you enter two bars
On this discussion, people saying that we don’t have 6/8, 9/8, 12/8 time signature support is baffling to me.
For example, for 12/8. You can set the notation time signature to 12/8 and view 12/8 notation. And you can enter 3 chords per beat, which is 12 chords per bar. And more importantly, 100% of the styles, realtracks, realdrums work with these time signatures.
If you’re looking for something like 11/8 or 5/8, you’re correct in that we don’t support those yet.
Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,589
PG Music Staff
|
|
PG Music Staff
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,589 |
Paul, You may have made a mistake in the DAW when you set the time signature. This is a common mistake.m 6/8 with triplet feel has three 8th notes per beat. So the DAW (e.g. Reaper) typically gives you two options. To either: For a triplet feel 6/8 song …. (Right!) - set 6/8 as a compound time signature with THREE 8th notes per beat, and you tap your foot every three 8th notes. . Or (Wrong!) - set 6/8 as TWO 8th notes per beat and you tap your foot every two 8th notes Here’s an example of a user post that has this problem. Note this doesn’t involve biab, it just within his DAW. And as a result of this mistake, he has two tempos for the same song. Since it is a triplet song, there is only one tempo, which is 53, and so the DAW considering it to be a tempo of 80 is simply wrong, and fixed by resetting the time signature to triplet feel (compound) 6/8. ‘I have a midi track in my DAW that is in 6/8 time. Tempo is set to quarter note = 80; i.e. dotted quarter note = 53” https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=735804#Post735804
Last edited by PeterGannon; 05/12/24 09:02 AM.
Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Happy Victoria Day! (Monday, May 20th)
We are celebrating Victoria Day on Monday, May 20th!
Our availability through this long weekend is:
Saturday, May 18: Closed
Sunday, May 19: Closed
Monday, May 22: 6am-6pm PT
www.pgmusic.com/contact.htm
Henry Clarke: Revolutionize Your Band-in-Box® Tracks with Regenerating Function
User Video: Next-Level AI Music Editing with ACE Studio and Band-in-a-Box®
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 German for Windows is Here!
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 für Windows Deutsch ist verfügbar!
Wir waren fleißig und haben über 50 neue Funktionen und eine erstaunliche Sammlung neuer Inhalte hinzugefügt, darunter 222 RealTracks, neue RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, "Songs with Vocals" Artist Performance Sets, abspielbare RealTracks Set 3, abspielbare RealDrums Set 2, zwei neue Sets von "RealDrums Stems", XPro Styles PAK 6, Xtra Styles PAK 17 und mehr!
Paket | Was ist Neu
Update Your PowerTracks Pro Audio 2024 Today!
The Newest RealBand 2024 Update is Here!
The newest RealBand 2024 Build 5 update is now available!
Download and install this to your RealBand 2024 for updated print options, streamlined loading and saving of .SGU & MGU (BB) files, and to add a number of program adjustments that address user-reported bugs and concerns.
This free update is available to all RealBand 2024 users. To learn more about this update and download it, head to www.pgmusic.com/support.realband.htm#20245
The Band-in-a-Box® Flash Drive Backup Option
Today (April 5) is National Flash Drive Day!
Did you know... not only can you download your Band-in-a-Box® Pro, MegaPAK, or PlusPAK purchase - you can also choose to add a flash drive backup copy with the installation files for only $15? It even comes with a Band-in-a-Box® keychain!
For the larger Band-in-a-Box® packages (UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition), the hard drive backup copy is available for only $25. This will include a preinstalled and ready to use program, along with your installation files.
Backup copies are offered during the checkout process on our website.
Already purchased your e-delivery version, and now you wish you had a backup copy? It's not too late! If your purchase was for the current version of Band-in-a-Box®, you can still reach out to our team directly to place your backup copy order!
Note: the Band-in-a-Box® keychain is only included with flash drive backup copies, and cannot be purchased separately.
Handy flash drive tip: Always try plugging in a USB device the wrong way first? If your flash drive (or other USB plug) doesn't have a symbol to indicate which way is up, look for the side with a seam on the metal connector (it only has a line across one side) - that's the side that either faces down or to the left, depending on your port placement.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forums66
Topics81,814
Posts737,561
Members38,592
| |
Most Online2,537
Jan 19th, 2020
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Dansk
Deutsch - Windows
Español
Français - Windows
Italiano - Windows
Nederlands
Polski
Português
Svenskt
русский
Japanese
Simplified Chinese
Traditional Chinese
Korean